U.S.M.C. no longer teaching the fundamentals?

[BlackKnight]

Originally Posted by GD2A

My guess would be that they've already trained on irons. I doubt the sky is falling

Maybe. I've thought of this as well, but boot camp is finite. It is still 13 weeks. So, if this is what's happening then the fundamentals are still being shortchanged.

[bttbbob]

I was speaking with a Marine PMI from Parris Island at my Marine Corps League meeting. Marines have not trained with open sights since 2011. I was floored. There are units being sent to Afghanistan that aren't even issued BUIS........They are killing us.

http://archive.marinecorpstimes.com/...rifle-training

[BlackKnight]

Originally Posted by bttbbob

I was speaking with a Marine PMI from Parris Island at my Marine Corps League meeting. Marines have not trained with open sights since 2011. I was floored. There are units being sent to Afghanistan that aren't even issued BUIS........They are killing us.

http://archive.marinecorpstimes.com/...rifle-training

Greaaat...
So that begs the question, what happens if the scope fails?

[bttbbob]

Or if you have a damaged rifle and have to pick up an enemy combatants rifle.

[milkmanjoe]

Originally Posted by bttbbob

I was speaking with a Marine PMI from Parris Island at my Marine Corps League meeting. Marines have not trained with open sights since 2011. I was floored. There are units being sent to Afghanistan that aren't even issued BUIS........They are killing us.

http://archive.marinecorpstimes.com/...rifle-training

That explains why the young men didn't have a clue about irons. Still, I wonder what the training will be for Marines who are, say, jet engine mechanics vs a Marine who might actually utilize a weapon. I suspect I will hear that all Marines train alike and have the same skills. Come to my SC house for next Thanksgiving's Marine Appreciation Day, they are not all alike. I have said it before, I have Marine friends in their 30's who left the Corps, calling it pussified. Things have changed rapidly and I doubt those in charge are willing to talk about it.

[BlackKnight]

Originally Posted by milkmanjoe

That explains why the young men didn't have a clue about irons. Still, I wonder what the training will be for Marines who are, say, jet engine mechanics vs a Marine who might actually utilize a weapon. I suspect I will hear that all Marines train alike and have the same skills. Come to my SC house for next Thanksgiving's Marine Appreciation Day, they are not all alike. I have said it before, I have Marine friends in their 30's who left the Corps, calling it pussified. Things have changed rapidly and I doubt those in charge are willing to talk about it.

The military, fortunately and unfortunately, changes with the times. They become a reflection of that particular generation. I'm seeing the same thing in law enforcement.
Scary to think that I've become that guy. You know, the old crusty SOB.

[milkmanjoe]

Originally Posted by BlackKnight

The military, fortunately and unfortunately, changes with the times. They become a reflection of that particular generation. I'm seeing the same thing in law enforcement.
Scary to think that I've become that guy. You know, the old crusty SOB.

I agree with timely change, but I suspect the last few years of changes have been less than timely and more political/ideological. I know quite a few Marines in their fifties, sixties, even a few in their eighties. The stories they tell me don't resemble what I see today. So, "old", or " crusty " to me translate into experienced in reality on the job.

[BlackKnight]

Originally Posted by milkmanjoe

I agree with timely change, but I suspect the last few years of changes have been less than timely and more political/ideological. I know quite a few Marines in their fifties, sixties, even a few in their eighties. The stories they tell me don't resemble what I see today. So, "old", or " crusty " to me translate into experienced in reality on the job.

I agree. Why the "unfortunate" part of my post.

[Snipersnest]

I remember "snapping in" for a week without firing a round at the range. We qualified out to 900 meters with iron sights. The Marine Corps was always based on marksmanship and the tenet that every man is a basic infantryman from the Commandant right down to the lowliest private. Chesty must be rolling in his grave!

[pony up]

The rifle range Quonset huts were the first taste of some freedom after about 8 weeks, as I recall, of hell week, non stop. Also the first time for one on one coaching with the exception of our DI comprehensively kicking my ass all over PI while demonstrating to the rest of the Gen. A A Vandergrift Platoon how to win a Pugil stick/bayonet fight...about 5 separate times. I think he liked me. He always went out of his way to prove he had no favorites. I did a little better each time. The last time I either put him down or he took a dive. He put his arm around my shoulders and told me I just might make a Marine after all. Gunny Floyd was a good man and a hell of a DI. Oh, we sure never had weapons like that and most certainly did not have starched and ironed utilities. Check out the covers. That is NOT wash rack stuff. PI have house boys now?